[10/19] ANGERME 5th single : Umaku Ienai / Ai no Tame / Wasurete Ageru

[keaine]

It comes down to what you want from a chart. Oricon clearly doesn't want to just count sales anymore but want to show more who is actually popular in this digital / idol age. You could argue for both kind of charts. But in the end of the day it indeed doesn't change the actual popularity of a group.

I also don't think that this change will have an effect on the number of sales gimmicks. The events are not just for Oricon, but also for the fans. And let's not forget that a sale that isn't counted by Oricon doesn't represent a sale for Up Front. The record companies and music stores still get revenue from these events.

Is it an error or have I learned something?

[Celedam]

Billboard is pro-fans since (at least the US Billboard) they consider a certain amount of views/streams as an album purchase.

Are you sure? Maybe you're thinking of the Hot 100 chart?

[Zunu]

You could argue for both kind of charts.

That's true. The main Billboard Hot 100 chart (in the US) has traditionally relied on a mixture of sales and radio play to determine chart position, but in recent years has also given weight to digital downloads, streams, YouTube streams, possibly even ringtones at one point. They keep adjusting the exact weighting algorithm based on changing circumstances.

But Billboard also have a less prominent Hot Singles sales chart which unsurprisingly goes by strict physical sales. It's doubtless of some use to brick-and-mortar retailers that need to determine how much of a ranking single they should maintain in stock. As you say, both kinds of charts are useful depending on the situation. But the latter chart is subordinate to the main chart because it doesn't truly encapsulate the popularity ranking that gives Billboard a special claim to expertise.

I also don't think that this change will have an effect on the number of sales gimmicks. The events are not just for Oricon, but also for the fans.

Yeah if I wasn't clear I don't have a problem with the gimmicks per se, I just feel that it's better if they're not permitted to game the charts. And also, I'd like to think that Up-Front et al. will maximally benefit from actually pleasing the fans by making stuff that has true and enduring popularity over "milking" the fans for chart numbers. It always saddens me when I watch one of those song-type Japanese game shows, and they'll occasionally use fairly contemporary AKB/Johnny's/EXILE stuff, but only the same few 15 year old Morning Musume/Petit Moni/Ayaya hits, and 0 of any H!P songs/groups that came into existence after 2003. We've had plenty of weekly #1s so what gives? A top ranking song should make some kind of lasting impression, not just melt away. Have we been to some extent deluded by fake-comforting chart numbers? Because somehow it seems, that even with the past few years' resurgence, that without widespread sales and airplay, H!P remains forever niche. It's an amazing niche, and I've mostly made my peace with it, but damn, we've got some good songs that really ought to be stuck in Japan's collective consciousness.

And let's not forget that a sale that isn't counted by Oricon doesn't represent a sale for Up Front.

I don't follow your meaning here. A sale's a sale whether Oricon notices it or not...right?

[Amped]

Oha4 morning news 10.20.16 - Angerme release event at Ikebukuro



http://www.nikkansports.com/entertainme ... 26565.html
http://news.walkerplus.com/article/90255/
http://www.sponichi.co.jp/entertainment ... 67550.html

Nakanishi, Kasahara interview

http://news.dwango.jp/2016/10/19/108757/idol/

[CaptainBerryzGiraffe]

Is it an error or have I learned something?

I think what they're saying is that, even though it's not portrayed by Oricon, it doesn't mean that that's the amount of sales in total. UF* is probably getting many many more sales than that.
So, even though we see 16k on Oricon, it could easily be 30k for UF*

[Amped]

Oricon news


Jijipress


Maidigitv

[Nayoko-Kihara]

You could argue for both kind of charts.

Pretty much. I don't care a lot about the numbers generally, my only issue with the change is the feeling that a fact (roughly, I know it was never entirely accurate) is being misrepresented. I don't care if someone bought 50 copies, or what they'll do with them afterwards. Their money, their business. If I for whatever reason want to check in on sales chart, I would expect for all 50 copies to be included.

It will however be interesting to see if any companies try to come up with new methods to get around it.

[Amped]

Yesterday at the Ikebukuro event, Takeuchi Akari declared that they are aiming to defeat Morning Musume. '16 and become number one when it comes to the variety of different characters/personalities in their group. Angerme is said to be the "individualistic group" of Hello! Project.

It announced that Angerme's single ranked #1, #2, and #3 daily in Mora's hi-resolution downloads ranking (10/20)

http://mora.jp/topics/news/angerme-1020/
http://mora.jp/ranking?genre=hires&term ... &year=2016

[CaptainBerryzGiraffe]

See, this is some proof that Oricon's rankings are meh.
I do agree, a "sales" chart should tell you how much was sold, regardless of "country". (Maybe Oricon should do a "Japan" sales vs "worldwide" or something.)

But the fact that it's #1,#2,#3 in Mora's hi-res downloads ranking says a lot. I think.

[Amped]

2nd day at #8
http://www.oricon.co.jp/rank/js/d/2016-10-19/